Why I carry unloaded.

[Paul]

I wanted to post my reason for not carrying loaded. When I first got my permit I carried unloaded for a few months to get in the habit of carrying and get comfortable with all my daily habits and routines. After a few months I started carrying loaded. I carried several different guns in several different setups and was totally comfortable carrying loaded.

I live about 2 blocks away from work. I go to work before the rest of my family is up. One morning my wife called me and asked me if I wanted to come home for pancakes. (She does this once or twice a year for some reason….) So I went home, sat down, and started wolfing down pancakes. About 5 minutes into breakfast my son, who was probably 10 years old at the time, came out of the bathroom, sat down at the table and said, “Dad, your gun is in the bathroom.” I about messed my pants.

I had been carrying a Ruger LCR in a pocket holster for a few months and that was the gun I had left in the bathroom. For some reason that morning in the 1 second it took to get my gun from its safe location and put it in my pocket I got sidetracked and set it on top of the vitamins on the countertop. And I left it sitting there, fully loaded. I had been at work for about an hour and hadn't realized I didn't have my gun in my pocket. My wife and other kids had been in that bathroom that morning and not seen it. At the time I had a 7 year-old, a 4 year-old, and a 1 year-old.

I hurried into the bathroom, got the gun, and put it in my pocket and sheepishly came out to the breakfast table. I told my son, “Kade, thank you. You did the right thing.” He replied something like, “Huh.” I repeated by self, “Kade, thanks for doing the right thing and telling me about my gun.” I explained to him I had forgotten my gun and had left it on the countertop and I was sure proud he did the right thing. He responded, “I thought you were testing me to see what I would do.” My wife was right here and didn’t scold me or say one word. She still hasn’t chastised me for being stupid. We have talked about this event several times, including with my kids.

Here’s my concern. What would have happened if my 4 year-old, or 1 year-old had found that gun instead of my oldest son? Would they have done the right thing? I’m not sure. I think my 7 year-old would have done the right thing, but I’m not totally sure about that either. If my 4 year-old or 1 year-old had gotten that gun and started playing with it, he could have killed himself or someone else. I PROVED that day that I make mistakes. I had been carrying for years and never done that. I have had times were I have “lost” my gun for a short amount of time though. I’ve left it in the door of my vehicle to run into the Post Office and forgotten about it for a few hours.

I decided right then and there, I would NEVER carry a revolver. It’s too easy for someone to “load” an unloaded revolver. Any child can do that. I also decided I will only carry semi-auto’s now. My youngest kids can’t load a semi-auto. I figured I would rather die because I don’t have time to load my gun, than attend my son’s funeral because I made a simple mistake. Anybody that doesn’t think they will ever forget their gun or leave it out is making a serious mistake. Remember it only take a few seconds of “forgetting” your gun for a tragedy to occur. Remember the grandma in Florida shopping with her grandchild?
http://www.wistv.com/Global/story.asp?S=8451232
It can happen to anybody. It will happen to every person that is reading this post at some point. I guarantee it. If you think you will never forget your gun, you are being a fool.

When I teach my CFP classes I explain to my students that the decision to carry loaded or unloaded is a very, very, personal decision. Nobody should try to force another to carry a certain way, nor should anyone EVER scold or mock another person because his or her carry choice is different. I hear a lot of people say thing that are derogatory and demeaning to those of us that choose to carry unloaded. It offends me. My choice is one of safety and love.

Remember I PROVED I can leave a loaded gun out where my kids can get to it. I have yet to be in a situation where I have ever needed my gun. I figure the chances of someone getting hurt because I’m human and occasionally make careless mistakes is higher than my chance of dying because I don’t have a round in the chamber. I hope if I ever need my gun I will have enough time to rack the slide. It’s a personal decision.

Now having said that it is very likely that in the future I will probably start carrying loaded again. As my youngest kids get older I may. Who knows? Circumstances and situations change. Each of us are in different situations. I applaud anyone that chooses to carry a gun or have a gun to protect themselves or their loved ones. I will never judge a person for their choice to carry loaded or unloaded. So there you have it. Why I carry unloaded.

[quychang]

Not so very different than my reason, I would have AD'd if it had been loaded. My youngest child is 24 and I can't get him to even go to the range, he won't touch it. So when mine is unloaded, which is most of the time, it's because I've proven to myself that I can screw up....when I no longer worry about that, then it will prolly be loaded all the time.

Mel

[jwalk]

That's exactly my reasoning on it. The chances of me leaving a loaded gun where my kids could get to it are very, very small. Even so, everyone makes mistakes and that's not one I'm willing to take. If I ever run into a situation where I really needed one in the chamber then so be it, I'll take the consequences for that. I just think that the chances of me making a mistake are much higher than the chance that I'll run into a situation where I don't have time to load my gun.

[tire iron]

That is most intelligent reason I have ever heard for not having a round in the chamber. In fact that the ONLY reason I have ever heard that makes logical sense to me for not carrying a round in the chamber.

There are very logical arguments against every other reason for not having a round in the chamber - but not one for your reason.

I am going to add that tidbit into my CCW courses. That certainly is food for thought.

I will continue to carry with one "up the spout" - but totally understand and see how you arrived at your decision to carry an empty chamber.

Just out of curiosity - would a thumb safety (like on a S&W M&P) be a viable option to carry with one in the chamber?

cheers

tire iron

[Paul]

That is most intelligent reason I have ever heard for not having a round in the chamber. In fact that the ONLY reason I have ever heard that makes logical sense to me for not carrying a round in the chamber.

There are very logical arguments against every other reason for not having a round in the chamber - but not one for your reason.

I am going to add that tidbit into my CCW courses. That certainly is food for thought.

I will continue to carry with one "up the spout" - but totally understand and see how you arrived at your decision to carry an empty chamber.

Just out of curiosity - would a thumb safety (like on a S&W M&P) be a viable option to carry with one in the chamber?

cheers

tire iron

A child can manipulate a thumb safety. A child has a difficult time racking a slide. A thumb safety would help if a kid ever got a gun, but not enough, in my opinion.

I have meet a lot of people that seem to look down their noses at people that don't carry loaded and seem to think it is because we are scared of the gun, or not confident, or don't understand the weapon and they typically act like those of us that carry unloaded are inferior or stupid in some way. Thats what bugs me. It's just such a personal think it bugs me to no end when people act like there is only 1 right way to carry a gun. I hate hearing an unloaded gun referred to as a "rock" or worthless or other such things. Most of the time when a gun is used a shot isn't fired. The loaded group points to all the videos and such where someone died because their gun wasn't loaded. (The jewelry store robbery a year ago was an excellent video to see for how important it would have been had that guy had his gun loaded.) But for every one of those instances there are just as many where someone got shot accidently because the gun was loaded. Anyway, I hope my story helped some of the unloaded group feel less inferior.

[UtahJarhead]

I carry loaded 100% of the time. I don't disparage those that don't, though. To date, I have NEVER left a gun lying around but one time. It was left in my pants pocket in my bedroom for about an hour. When I found out, I freaked... Valuable lesson learned.

I keep a GunVault combo safe next to the bed. The gun stays in there at night. If I have work the next morning (I wake up at 5:15am) then I leave the safe open with the gun in it. If there's no work the next day, it's locked shut in case my kid wakes up before I do. If I set it down EVER, it's in the safe or it's on top of the medicine cabinet while I shower downstairs. I just hope I stay so diligent!

[faydee]

paul exact same reason that i carry without one in the chamber... i dont have a good enough holster right now to keep it on my 100% of the time so i set it up on a high shelf most the time whne i am home... my almost 3yr is very interested in "daddys boom!" (that is what he calls my gun) and i know there is no way he is strog enough to rack the silde of my G17 gen 4 cause my wife cant even rack it... so for now when i have to take it off a lot for comfort i leave the pipe empty. when i get a better holster i will switch to fully loaded and ready to rock but then i will be wearing it 100% of the time and or in my safe (by the bed) at night...

[CoyoteG]

I have always felt that if I decide to pull my weapon, for whatever reason, I could do it with time and motion to rack the slide first. When I first began cc'ing, I did carry loaded as well. For some reason I just never liked the feeling of that round sitting there with the firing pin ready to drop at any moment. Then the incident of the guy in a Carls Jr bathroom who's XD went off while in the stall kinda put me over the edge. I couldn't stop thinking about all the possibilities, maybe that sounds stupid. It certainly is a very personal decision and I don't scoff at those who do carry loaded. Do whatever makes you feel safe and comfortable for sure.

[Shadehawk]

[nogs]

I carried unloaded until I had a near run-in with a pit bull. I thought that I'd have time to rack it in whatever situation I'm in. That dog showed me that I was wrong. I'm 100% loaded and ready at all times.

[faydee]

I carried unloaded until I had a near run-in with a pit bull. I thought that I'd have time to rack it in whatever situation I'm in. That dog showed me that I was wrong. I'm 100% loaded and ready at all times.

honestly that is what i am most worried about... a person i am not going to let get that close to me

[My Trigger Guard]

Well I do not want to turn this into a debate or arguement, I repsect whatever decision people make its up to them. I like to present my opionons and some facts.

I teach that if you are not comfortable carrying fully loaded, then you should practice practice practice until you are, but do not rush things, you will know when you are ready. I do not comprehend the purpose of an unloaded firearm, or a car without gas or a computer without electricity.

20ft drill anyone? People ussually fail it unless they are aware the drill is about to begin and they can mentaly/physically prepare. I can not even imagine the latency in reaction time if you also had to rack the slide.

My advice ussually if someone will not carry loaded or will never be comfortable doing said, carry a full tang knife or an asp as well. But I would strongly agree not everyone should or will carry fully loaded, but at least they carry and BG doesnt know its not loaded.

[Paul]

For lots of unloaded carriers (myself included) it's not an issue of "train, train, train", or confidence.
It's a simple risk analysis.
I simply think someone (most likely one of my children) is more likely to get hurt because I am human (it only takes 1 single mistake to kill someone) than I am to get hurt because my carry gun is not loaded.
It's a simple difference in our analysis of the risks we face. Different people have very different circumstances which can affect their risk analysis.
From what I read something like 90% of the time a gun is used in a defensive situation, a shot is NOT fired. (No I can't link an article to quote that) And Mike is right, the bad guy doesn't know if my gun is loaded or not. And unloaded gun is a VERY powerful tool in my opinion. It can also be converted to a MORE powerful tool with the simple act of loading the gun.

My Trigger Guard,
Are you really serious when you say "I do not comprehend the purpose of an unloaded firearm" ? You can't seriously mean that. And I really hope as an instructor you seriously consider whether teaching that is fair to your students. I doubt you mean that as you stated it, but seriously think about what you wrote.
Now if you ask me, or lots of others, "If you needed a firearm to immediately defend yourself, would you rather it be loaded or unloaded?" we would all obviously respond, LOADED.
Now let me ask you a question.
If you needed a firearm to immediately defend yourself, would you rather have NO GUN, or an unloaded gun? (Utah unloaded or course, full magazine, just not one in the chamber.)
Maybe this question will help you comprehend the "purpose of an unloaded firearm"
Maybe you should ask the Israelis about the "purpose of an unloaded firearm"
Maybe you should ask our own military about the "purpose of an unloaded firearm"
I'm not trying to pick a fight or be a jerk. I do think that everyone of us here though, instructors ESPECIALLY, needs to think about this. Be mindful of how you teach this critical issue. Be mindful of how you may make your students feel. Realize there are highly educated, highly competent, well trained individuals here that do NOT carry loaded and do so for very personal reasons that are very well thought out. Just because your way is different does not mean your way is right and our way is wrong. I don't think your way is wrong. It's just not my way at this moment in my life. We can both be right! But don't insult your students or others by saying an unloaded gun has no purpose.

[UtahCFP]

I'll toss in a couple of cents here (my two cents, that is).

I tell students to do what is comfortable for them. I also ask them to watch news reports and ask themselves "what might I have done in that situation". It isn't unusual for people to change how and when they carry over time, as they become more experienced and knowledgable.

I've known people who decided on pepper spray or Taser as the most dangerous thing they were willing to carry -- at least at that time. I've known folks who carried an empty firearm until they became confident in how to carry, conceal, and store. Others rack a round in only as they are putting the firearm into holster, and remove ammunition when removed from holster. I know people that will call you unprepared if you are only carrying ONE firearm. Do whatever it is that floats your boat.

Might you be caught off-guard and lose precious seconds when the pit bull jumps out of the bushes at you? Sure. Might you have enough time to halt an attack (think Aurora) even if you didn't have a round in the chamber? Maybe. Might you be hosed either way? Sure is possible.

Gun fights suck. You can do everything right and still lose. You can do just about everything wrong and still win. The firearm, and your ability to properly use it, increases the odds of you surviving a violent encounter. You have to choose for yourself what the risks are, and how you will prepare to mitigate the risks.

[Paul]

I'll toss in a couple of cents here (my two cents, that is).

I tell students to do what is comfortable for them. I also ask them to watch news reports and ask themselves "what might I have done in that situation". It isn't unusual for people to change how and when they carry over time, as they become more experienced and knowledgable.

I've known people who decided on pepper spray or Taser as the most dangerous thing they were willing to carry -- at least at that time. I've known folks who carried an empty firearm until they became confident in how to carry, conceal, and store. Others rack a round in only as they are putting the firearm into holster, and remove ammunition when removed from holster. I know people that will call you unprepared if you are only carrying ONE firearm. Do whatever it is that floats your boat.

Might you be caught off-guard and lose precious seconds when the pit bull jumps out of the bushes at you? Sure. Might you have enough time to halt an attack (think Aurora) even if you didn't have a round in the chamber? Maybe. Might you be hosed either way? Sure is possible.

Gun fights suck. You can do everything right and still lose. You can do just about everything wrong and still win. The firearm, and your ability to properly use it, increases the odds of you surviving a violent encounter. You have to choose for yourself what the risks are, and how you will prepare to mitigate the risks.